Helping Amazing Organisations Achieve Remarkable Things | Rob Dobell | PHIT Podcast – This week’s episode we speak to Rob Dobell of Hart Square consulting. This episode is hosted by Mark and Racheal. It’s a great interview and well worth a listen.
The Questions
1. Tell me a little about what you do, your business, job/role?
2. Thinking about the (people and/or technology impacts of the) last year, what lessons will you take forward and how do you see these being delivered?
3. Do you think users have grown in their confidence in using technology since lockdown?
4. What’s the best piece of business and/or career advice you’ve been given?
The Links
You can view – Helping Organizations achieve remarkable things – Rob Dobell Part 1 on YouTube
You can listen to – Helping Organizations achieve remarkable things – Part 1 on Anchor or Spotify
Previous Episodes
- Episode 1 Part 1 – Never turn down an Opportunity – Special Guest Jono Atherton
- Episode 1 Part 2 – – Gain the trust of the human first – Special Guest Jono Atherton
- Episode 2 Part 1 – Own the Customer – Special Guest Carl Grieves
- Episode 2 Part 2 – Going Live is the beginning – Special Guest Carl Grieves
Previous Series | PHIT Podcast
You can view all our previous episodes here
Key Takeaways
• Really attach to (clients) causes
• It (remote working) became very much a people situation AND a culture thing.
• (Organizations have learnt) People can be productive when they are remote
• Having personal contact really does matter to us
• Help amazing organizations achieve remarkable things
• There are lots of different ways to get the most out of technology
• Find the way that works best for you
• We’re 10 years into the digital age…and suddenly we embraced it (Fantastic)
• People (now) feel empowered to find new solutions
• Do what you love…
The Transcript
Question 1 – Tell me a little about what you do, your business, job/role?
Rob Dobell 01:38
Yeah, for sure. So. I’m the managing director of Hart Square. We’re a small consultancy, a management consultancy who work exclusively with nonprofits. So, all of our clients, are charities, professional membership bodies, trade associations, or healthcare, academic institutions. I’ve been with Hart Square since pretty much since the outset. So, I’ve been there since 2010. And actually, my role has flowed a little bit in the same way as the organization’s grown.
When we started off, and we were project managing CRM implementations for memberships, I joined to develop that as a service. And then strategically we’ve grown. So, we’ve been involved earlier in those conversations, we now do a lot more by way of offering strategic advice, and helping nonprofits make business cases for investment and for change.
And we do see it very much as being about our role being about helping nonprofits to change, you know, to move themselves forward. And so we get involved, like I say, earlier in conversations and working with different stakeholders now, while still doing what we originally do. So we have a team of consultants who are still project managing technology implementations, if that’s what a nonprofit clients choose to do. And I don’t do that anymore. Unfortunately, I’m not allowed onto the coalface much now.
Question 2 – Thinking about the (people and/or technology impacts of the) last year, what lessons will you take forward and how do you see these being delivered?
Rob Dobell 05:39
When the pandemic first broke out, and people went into lockdown, and we have to stop traveling and, and going into offices, Hart Square, in some ways, was quite well positioned. Because we are consultants. So we’re out and about a lot, we were not like, we may be office based, but it’s not our own office, we used to be in remote with each other and that kind of idea. And so our focus initially was on helping clients who did struggle, there was a lot of clients who it did shed a light really on where people were with their tech, you know, there are a number of people who, who didn’t, who couldn’t actually continue to operate because they didn’t have remote access to their systems. So that was a bit of a surprise, actually.
But now, wouldn’t we take it for granted, you know, but there were literally genuinely a couple of clients who the only option they had, the only remote working capability they had as such was Outlook on a smartphone. And that was about it, you know, literally on the day, it’s, you know, March the 16th, 23rd, whatever it was when we could no longer go in? You know, don’t get me wrong, that’s a few of our clients, we have clients across the range, some very advanced, you know, some whom, actually working remotely wasn’t a problem, technically. And it became very much a people situation and a culture thing.
You know, again, it’s been it has been enlightening in terms of seeing how organizations work, have different people, have different, probably, attitudes towards kind of, I think management of staff is one of the the key things that’s come out. There were a number of people that we know, you know, a number of who we see around who, and who have that kind of more traditional mindset that, you know, if you can see someone working their work, and if they’re not, they can’t be.
And, you know, and that mold actually has been smashed completely, there can’t be an organization now, who has just survived the last 18 months, who can argue against the fact that people can be productive when they’re remote, and people can collaborate, collaborate remotely, which I think is a really good thing to know, we’ve learned how to make the best of the tools available, how to actually adopt new tools, and make the best of them quickly. And that it doesn’t have to take month after month after month to do something new. And so it’s a really positive sides of things like that.
I think, maybe a bit going across to some of the negatives, I suppose, I was going to say, the negative being that it’s been really tough on people, you know, for people, individuals being, you know, cooped up, or whatever you want to describe it being remote. So technically, we’ve been able to prove the case you can do it, you can deliver, you can work, you can be effective, but I think it has actually brought home equally, how much having personal contact really does matter to us as individuals, you know, I think our resilience has been tested beyond any other situation I’ve ever been in, you know, we’ve all had, you know, ups and downs and stuff like that, but nothing quite as significant as it’s not as impactful as this, I think.
And it really has, you know, we’ve always talked about ourselves, being a people business, you know, we, we work with people, it’s about people, you know, it’s not about the tech, the tech is an enabler, that kind of idea. Actually, in many ways. What’s happened the last 18 months shows how important it is that we remember, we are individuals, we are people, and we have our own needs as well as those things that we need to deliver and want to deliver within our work and through the tech. So, you know, I think pros, strengths, positive negatives all around. Primarily, actually, it’s almost always feels guilty but, in many ways, in a work context, the primary impact has actually probably been positive, in that it has driven change.
I go back to it has shown people that they can adopt new technology at pace, it’s shown people they can adopt new ways of working that pays it shows people they can trust their employees and their staff, and actually that their employees and staff are really committed to their causes in the way we always thought they were but it really has brought it home hasn’t it because, you know, everybody has stood up and done their thing and survived. You know, I know a number of nonprofits haven’t been able to weather the storm. But certainly all of our clients have, actually, a surprising number of nonprofits have, have invested and been able to invest in their time through necessity. But they’ve done it and they’re doing it quite successfully.
How have you found managing or changing the culture of Hart Square in a distributed world?
Rob Dobell 11:59
Yeah, no, it has been a challenge, like you say, we’ve been a distributed workforce, but rooted in a quite strong induction, you know, and when people join us, we’re very, you know, we are very committed to the sector, that’s what we’re all about, you know, our mission statement is that we help amazing organizations achieve remarkable things. You know, it’s not about us, it’s about what we hope to aspire to helping our clients to achieve.
Like I say, most of us have worked in the sector before. So, culture is incredibly important to us. Previously, if you joined us, if you joined in 2018, 2019, or previously, you would have time in the office with key people, with the leadership team, and with your peers and colleagues, and getting, and actually we kind of quite insistent that it was at least six weeks, maybe longer, no matter how experienced you are, it’s gonna be at least six weeks or longer, before you were actively working on client sites, despite the fact that we’re, you know, we’re a consultancy, time & materials, all that kind of stuff. It’s an investment we make, because we thought it was incredibly important to embed our culture, not just our way of working, but actually our, our whole ethos.
And so it has been a challenge for us, because we have had to recruit during the pandemic. And I think what it’s done actually, it is a positive, actually, it’s forced us to be more explicit and more defined about that, you know, to be honest, a little bit more formal, but actually to bring together our thoughts not to rely on being able to impart information, almost in passing, but actually to try and write some of this stuff down to, to look at ourselves a little bit better, and actually structure some of that a little bit more so that we can impart that knowledge.
Question 3 – Do you think users have grown in their confidence in using technology since lockdown?
Rob Dobell 14:59
Yeah, I think they have, again, you know, necessity has driven that. But I think what people have found is that, actually, there are lots of different ways to get the most out of technology. And what is really important is to find the way that works best for you.
You know, the simplistic version of that, is a description I’ve used previously, it’s just a really simple basic version where, you know, you look at Outlook or Word or Excel or one of those one of those daily tools that we all use. But you know, Google’s insane, right? Anything you want to do is there, there’s about five or six different ways of doing it, you know, use keyboard shortcuts, you use F buttons, you use mouse clicks, whatever. There’s no right way of doing it.
And this is a conversation I have with people who are less technically competent, there is no right way, doesn’t matter how you do it. Yeah, it’s about being able to achieve what you want to achieve. So, find your way, find your path. And I think taking something hopefully, which is as simple and relatable as that example. And scaling up to anything you want to do is a really good way where people have felt that they, you know, that they’ve been concerned that they haven’t got that natural support of, you know, someone sitting next to them, someone sitting opposite them, and actually saying to them, it’s okay, no one’s watching. So, take your time, find your way you will get there. And anything we can do to help, obviously, we will.
But I think that if that was the first three or four month experience through the spring of last year, going into the summer and autumn of last year, I think we saw a real surge actually, in people’s confidence, you know, in the confidence of individuals within our client organizations, you know, to actually, whether it’s engaging in UAT programs, or just, you know, in describing what they do, you know, when you’re, when you’re doing that first piece, and you’re talking about business process, and think people have more confidence in that.
And I think actually, you know, coming through a shock to the system, such that we did have, has given people that opportunity to think more, which requires them to think more about what they do, and then given them the confidence actually, I do know my stuff. Yeah, and I do know how to do this. And I can get on with technology, you know, I can now, you know, I can now call my, my dad and have a video call with him.
You know, which is ridiculous when it, in some respects, it used to be the other way, right. I could look down at my grandchildren, you know, as a three year-old Face Timing me or something like that, you know, but not go the other way. But I think if you look around generally, you know, society has been digitized, hasn’t it? By necessity. So, we have, you know, we’re 10 years into the digital age, and suddenly we embraced it, which is fantastic.
Maybe we should re-phrase the question to whether users have become more inquisitive about finding better ways of doing things
Rob Dobell 18:57
Yeah, I think that’s a really good, really good point. And that is what we’re seeing I think people are, you know, I suppose it’s partly because they’re now more reliant on the technology so that they have no, you know, they don’t have alternative methods, but necessarily, so they have felt more, I guess, competent to explore, to look at different ways of doing things.
And I think that’s actually also shown looking at us as a distributed organization and seeing it elsewhere as well. We are more collaborative in that respect. So, we have various, again, various tools that we use… your chat tools, and whatever. And I see individuals within our team being more confident asking others, asking for their kind of peer support in that respect. You know, I’m trying to do this. Have you seen that? Have you got a client doing this, whatever? And I also see that playing out client side. So, I think you’re absolutely on the money Mark, that people are taking confidence, and it’s making them inquisitive. And again, that’s a really good thing.
Because they have got the confidence then to look at a better way of doing things and that’s not just, you know, a move to using keystrokes on all mouse clicks on desktop productivity, but it is actually, that then flows into, I think, you know, I used to be able to, I used to have my bit of paper and walk across the office and put it somewhere and do something with it. Now, I can’t do that. So, I will, I will invent a digital process, you know, and then, and they know, they have to do it, and that almost the necessity of doing I think, has helped them to succeed, because people do, you know, because people are so committed, I am going to make it work, I have to find a way to work. And you know what, there is no, there is no physical alternative. Yeah, there is no, there’s no option to fail, actually, in that respect is there, you know, so, it’s not quite rock and a hard place. Actually, I think people have embraced it. And I really, I see a lot of people I think, who are enjoying their work more for it, because they do feel empowered, you know, to go and find new solutions.
Question 4 – What’s the best piece of business/career advice you’ve ever been given?
Rob Dobell 22:18
And I think probably, in terms of career advice, the best piece, the best piece of career advice I’ve personally been given was something that many years ago now, which was actually to do what I love, because you know, it’s work. It dominates our life, doesn’t it? If you look at the number of hours that we put into it, and the energy and what it takes out of us? I think, yes.
So, I have had jobs that I wasn’t particularly connected to, you know, as we all do, when we’re trying to find a way to start with. But yeah, many years ago, someone said to me, you know, I took a mid 20s break, went around the world, a friend got married in New Zealand, yes, I had a break , a natural break, came back and was talking to my previous boss and said, like, you know, what do you think for now, and it was at a time where there were different avenues, different things happening, you know, in the 90s, and stuff, so the age of digital and things.
And she said to me, you know, find what you love and do that if you can, if that’s where you’re working, then you will have the energy to do what you need to do. And you will also, you know, you’ll enjoy your success more, you know, there’s lots of ways of succeeding. But if it’s something that you truly are connected to, then it will mean that much more to you. And therefore, you’ll be better at it, and therefore you will succeed more, and it’s a really nice cycle to get into. It’s not easy to find that path. But I think that’s where, you know, for me, actually, you know, from previous conversations about we both were like minded, you know, so in this particular sector, you know, is its passion. And that’s what really drives us and sustains me, to be honest.
Useful Links
Putting the Human Into Technology With Simon Grosse and Liz Rogers
You don’t need a degree to work in IT – Episode 7 Ben Morris
0 Comments